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#5

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12/07/09 3:34 PM

Here is a nice Toughest Path to a State Championship chart from which to debate. It doesn't take into consideration the SOS though for regular season wins. Based on Calpreps PR numbers only, it looks like this years DCC is best though.

DIVISION 1
YEAR	TEAM	W	L	PCT.	W	L	PCT.
2003	Detroit Catholic Central	50	10	0.833	13	1	0.929
2000	Grand Ledge	50	10	0.833	13	1	0.929
2002	Detroit Catholic Central	48	12	0.800	13	1	0.929
2006	Macomb Dakota	47	13	0.783	13	1	0.929
2004	Rockford	47	13	0.783	12	2	0.857
2008	Rockford	47	13	0.783	13	1	0.929
2009	Detroit Catholic Central	47	13	0.783	14	0	1.000
2001	Detroit Catholic Central	46	14	0.767	11	3	0.786
1999	Walled Lake Western	46	14	0.767	14	0	1.000
2007	Macomb Dakota	44	16	0.733	14	0	1.000
2005	Rockford	43	17	0.717	12	2	0.857
	TOTAL	515	145	0.780	142	12	0.922

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#6

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12/07/09 3:35 PM

Plus the 2009 DCC is the first undefeated D1 team in the chart as well.

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BiasedGuy

#7

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12/07/09 7:28 PM

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I agree Baller. A good topic. And thanks for the info MrNCAA.

I think recent history skews the polling. At any rate, I think the 03 CC team had more offensive weapons than 09. It seems that they really utilized 3-4 backs that year, even though Brooks was the feature back. Plus Gingell was a very good kicker on both KOs and FG. That defense had some big hitters too. Darnell Tyson comes to mind. I don't know that the 03 line was any bigger than this year's though. Also, I think Dave Thomas was more of a running threat than Sam Landry was this year.

Speaking of that team, I saw half that backfield at the D1 Finals game.

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#8

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12/07/09 8:43 PM

Mr NCAA wrote:
Plus the 2009 DCC is the first undefeated D1 team in the chart as well.

So the 2007 Macomb Dakota 14-0 record doesn't count as "undefeated"?

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#9

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12/07/09 8:52 PM

So the 2007 Macomb Dakota 14-0 record doesn't count as "undefeated"?

Care to explain to the rest of us exactly what is wrong with my statement that you quoted?

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#10

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12/07/09 9:02 PM

I guess that I should be changing the order around a tad in my chart to reflect the regular season won loss record as a tiebreaker.

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#11

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12/07/09 9:23 PM

Teams in the chart are now rated by:
1. toughest path to the state championship
2. season won loss record
3. earliest year accomplished same result

So the 2009 DCC moved up quite a few spots in the chart now.

DIVISION 1
YEAR	TEAM	W	L	PCT.	W	L	PCT.
2000	Grand Ledge	50	10	0.833	13	1	0.929
2003	Detroit Catholic Central	50	10	0.833	13	1	0.929
2002	Detroit Catholic Central	48	12	0.800	13	1	0.929
2009	Detroit Catholic Central	47	13	0.783	14	0	1.000
2006	Macomb Dakota	47	13	0.783	13	1	0.929
2008	Rockford	47	13	0.783	13	1	0.929
2004	Rockford	47	13	0.783	12	2	0.857
1999	Walled Lake Western	46	14	0.767	14	0	1.000
2001	Detroit Catholic Central	46	14	0.767	11	3	0.786
2007	Macomb Dakota	44	16	0.733	14	0	1.000
2005	Rockford	43	17	0.717	12	2	0.857
	TOTAL	515	145	0.780	142	12	0.922

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#12

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12/08/09 1:17 PM

Mr NCAA wrote:

So the 2007 Macomb Dakota 14-0 record doesn't count as "undefeated"?

Care to explain to the rest of us exactly what is wrong with my statement that you quoted?

Sorry, but if you can't look at what you originally posted by itself and see anything wrong with it, your English is a tad bit screwy.

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#13

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12/08/09 2:23 PM

Sorry, but you can't read what I wrote. Perhaps you need to take some reading courses. 2009 DCC team comes before Macomb Dakota in the first and last chart that I produced on here. You read charts from top to bottom. This would like calling Searn's #32 the best team in his chart that he produces if he didn't have any numbers on it. So unless my eyes are very bad, you need some glasses. I would hate to have you as a ref as you wouldn't understand the rule book.

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#14

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12/08/09 2:52 PM

Plus based on how you read the chart, you forgot that the 1999 Walled Lake Western came before the 2007 Macomb Dakota team year wise. So it seems like you want it all ways in your interpretation on what I wrote.

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#15

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12/08/09 11:00 PM

This thread was about the best team of the 2000's so I wasn't including WLW in the first place, I don't know why you did. You said "first undefeated team," and since we were talking about the 2000's, Macomb Dakota would be the "first" undefeated team. The "best" undefeated team or the "top" undefeated team on the list would have been better wording. Have a nice day.

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#16

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12/08/09 11:20 PM

So can you read what I wrote that you objected to? It said the first undefeated team on my chart. Fact is 2009 DCC was and is that team. 2007 Macomb Dakota had an easier path to the state championship than the 2009 DCC team had. So that is why the 2009 DCC is higher in my chart. As such DCC is the first undefeated team in the chart. What part of that don't you understand? If I meant by year, I would have said year. I produced a chart so that was my reference. Plus if I said first team in my chart by year, I would have to say WLW as well since they are included in the chart produced. If I wanted to say 2007 Macomb Dakota is first by year according to my chart, I would have had to add a caveat that saying 1999 WLW was ineligible according to the top thread. I didn't say that thougjh. So have a nice day.

Last Edited By: Mr NCAA 12/08/09 11:25 PM. Edited 2 times.

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Searn

#17

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12/08/09 11:47 PM

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Now that that is settled ... Papa misunderstood and Mr. NCAA explained ... case closed.

Tough pick ... The toughest road chart shows a lot about the teams in question ... but still doesn't always tell the story.... the teams beat the playoff opponents put in front of them ...

I mean .. . I personally would put the last teams on the chart Rockford (05) and Dakota (07) over Grand Ledge (00) in terms of "who would beat who"

So while Mr. NCAA's chart certainly shows how much teams had to overcome to win the title ... it's only a part of the equation.

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#18

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12/08/09 11:49 PM

If I had to rank each one of these teams in an order they would beat one another, it would look something like this:

1. 2002 Detroit Catholic: Accidentally voted for the 2001 DCC team in this poll, as I had the years screwed up. Very good team who beat up one of the more solid teams I've ever seen in East Kentwood. Most would disagree with this one, but I saw no chance of EK being beaten that year, and DCC outplayed and out-muscled them.

2. 2009 Detroit Catholic: Another solid team with Capatina and Palazetti pacing the Shamrocks. Relentless running attack that many teams would have trouble beating.

3. 2006 Macomb Dakota: Dominant performance over the 2 time defending champs in the finals that year.

4. 2007 Macomb Dakota: Seemed to have an easier road to the title, and didn't look as dominant as the 2006 Cougars.

5. 2003 Detroit Catholic: Tied for the toughest road to the finals in the 2000's for D1. Helped them that they got Utica Eisenhower a lot early in the decade, and they were always second fiddle.

6. 2000 Grand Ledge: Still the best comeback/ending I've seen in a state championship game. There's not a single game that's more memorable to me sitting in the stands from a fan's standpoint.

7. 2004 Rockford: A little bit better than the other Rockford title teams in that they looked more impressive in their road to the title.

8. 2001 Detroit Catholic: My original vote by accident. They drop a little because they struggled in the regular season.

9. 2008 Rockford: No comment really, not a bad team, as none of them are, just don't measure up to the rest IMO.

10. 2005 Rockford: Had some "close calls" in the playoffs, mainly the last 3 games.

And Mr NCAA, I can see where you're coming from, but you're so thick headed that you can't see where I'm coming from. I can see why you get on a lot of people's nerves on here

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#19

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12/09/09 2:53 AM